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whatamydidnext
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Newbie and Novice here!

Post by whatamydidnext »

Hello everyone! :)/

I'm Amy. I'm studying an MA in Graphic Design at the minute, but I also love writing, so I thought I'd give Copywriting a shot because I find it super interesting.

As I said in the subject bar; I'm a total novice but I have been reading books and watching endless videos.

I'm hoping to get to grips with Copywriting and build a half decent portfolio, so any support or tips for that would be great.

I'll apologise in advance for the endless questions. I'm a bit of an over-thinker and I tend to ask questions that I could probably solve myself if I really thought about it, but I like to be doubly sure! :lol:

Any advice to start off with would be much appreciated. Thanks guys,

Amy. :)
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SARubin
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Re: Newbie and Novice here!

Post by SARubin »

Hello Amy, and welcome :)

Becoming a graphic designer AND copywriter will certainly make you a powerful force to be reckoned with.

No need to apologize for asking questions here. That's what this forum was created for.
As far as building a portfolio... What type of copy are you interested in starting with?

Are we talking about long form sales copy?

Or short form advertising copy?

Or Email copy?

Or article writing? (which I don't consider to be "copywriting" but some people group it under the same umbrella)

whatamydidnext wrote: November 6th, 2021, 4:54 pm Hello everyone! :)/

I'm Amy. I'm studying an MA in Graphic Design at the minute, but I also love writing, so I thought I'd give Copywriting a shot because I find it super interesting.
I agree. It is super interesting
A good marketer knows how to think like a marketer - A great marketer learns how to think like the customer...
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whatamydidnext
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Re: Newbie and Novice here!

Post by whatamydidnext »

SARubin wrote: November 6th, 2021, 6:14 pm Hello Amy, and welcome :)

Becoming a graphic designer AND copywriter will certainly make you a powerful force to be reckoned with.

No need to apologize for asking questions here. That's what this forum was created for.
As far as building a portfolio... What type of copy are you interested in starting with?

Are we talking about long form sales copy?

Or short form advertising copy?

Or Email copy?

Or article writing? (which I don't consider to be "copywriting" but some people group it under the same umbrella)

whatamydidnext wrote: November 6th, 2021, 4:54 pm Hello everyone! :)/

I'm Amy. I'm studying an MA in Graphic Design at the minute, but I also love writing, so I thought I'd give Copywriting a shot because I find it super interesting.
I agree. It is super interesting
Thank you! :)

I sort of want to be the Swiss Army knife of Graphic Design and Copywriting! :lol: I love designing, but I miss writing so I want to get started with it again.

I think I'd like to start off with short form advertising copy. Particularly things involving technology, art, photography, music, film/tv, food, cosmetics, fashion. I'd also love to write about things I care about: the environment, our oceans, animal rights, pollution etc (Bit of a tree hugger, yes.)

As a graphic designer, I love designing things for publication; magazines, brochures, catalogues and so on, so yes I would love to do a bit of article writing (I'd rather not have someone else's wording on my design work) so I guess I'm one of those people who considers articles to be copywriting, haha!

I'm worried about creating a portfolio though. Obviously I'm a total beginner; no experience, no past clients, nothing to show off. So how do I build an attractive portfolio? No one will hire me if I have no proven record of being a good writer, so I can't get any experience; it's a vicious circle!
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Re: Newbie and Novice here!

Post by Franklin »

Hi Amy -

Welcome to the forum. :)/
whatamydidnext wrote: November 6th, 2021, 7:03 pm
I think I'd like to start off with short form advertising copy. Particularly things involving technology, art, photography, music, film/tv, food, cosmetics, fashion. I'd also love to write about things I care about: the environment, our oceans, animal rights, pollution etc (Bit of a tree hugger, yes.)

As a graphic designer, I love designing things for publication; magazines, brochures, catalogues and so on, so yes I would love to do a bit of article writing (I'd rather not have someone else's wording on my design work) so I guess I'm one of those people who considers articles to be copywriting, haha!
That's a lot of different things to start with. You might want to niche down and pick the one or two things you're most passionate about to start with, then you can always expand as your experience grows.

I've seen a lot of new writers try to bite off more than they can chew. They almost always get overwhelmed and burnt out before they even get started.
“There are 3 kinds of people in this world. Those who can count, and those who can't”
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Re: Newbie and Novice here!

Post by SARubin »

whatamydidnext wrote: November 6th, 2021, 7:03 pm
Thank you! :)

I sort of want to be the Swiss Army knife of Graphic Design and Copywriting! :lol: I love designing, but I miss writing so I want to get started with it again.

I think I'd like to start off with short form advertising copy. Particularly things involving technology, art, photography, music, film/tv, food, cosmetics, fashion. I'd also love to write about things I care about: the environment, our oceans, animal rights, pollution etc (Bit of a tree hugger, yes.)
That's a very ambitious array of interest Amy, you've covered quite a few profitable niches here.
And a few environmentally responsible ones as well. Which I applaud because I'm an old tree hugger too :).

The only small issue I see is they're also quite competitive niches, with many writers who have a head start on you.
I'm with Franklin on this one. It might be more prudent to narrow your focus a little. At least in the beginning until you build your reputation.

whatamydidnext wrote: November 6th, 2021, 7:03 pm As a graphic designer, I love designing things for publication; magazines, brochures, catalogues and so on, so yes I would love to do a bit of article writing (I'd rather not have someone else's wording on my design work) so I guess I'm one of those people who considers articles to be copywriting, haha!

I'm worried about creating a portfolio though. Obviously I'm a total beginner; no experience, no past clients, nothing to show off. So how do I build an attractive portfolio? No one will hire me if I have no proven record of being a good writer, so I can't get any experience; it's a vicious circle!
Yes, it can be a vicious circle... But it doesn't need to be.

Right now you're in a bit of a catch 22 - You need experience to attract paying clients... but how can you get experience without any clients to write for?

If you just start putting yourself out there as an inexperienced writer, you're most likely going to attract low end clients and freebie hunters…
And in good conscience I can't recommend anyone building their reputation on that kind of a weak foundation.

Also, the competition for low end writers is fierce (as can be easily seen on any of the freelance farms like fiverr, freelancer, upwork, etc)

So because you have no experience, in this case I recommend you start creating your own experience.

Let me explain...

One word of caution: This is not a one or two day process. It could take weeks, or even months of effort before it pays off for you. But it's the kind of effort that most newbies will never do (because it's too much like real work) and as a result, if you're willing to play the long game, in a short while you'll be ahead of 90% of the other writers who are just starting out.


If you're going for content writing, then start writing content.
Find a couple niches that are interesting to you. Like I mentioned above - narrow it down at the beginning so you don't get too overwhelmed.

Study some of the more popular websites and study the articles and posts for their style and formatting.
And then start writing you own blog posts, essays and articles about that niche.

Write as if one of those top websites has commissioned you to write for them, and they are going to publish it. (in other words... don't half ass it. You will learn to write with the same discipline as you train. So write like you mean it.)

These samples will become part of your portfolio. And you can put your samples on display. (on your own blog or website, a social network, or somewhere your target audience hangs out...?)

This will be the beginning of your "experience". And if you want to sound more professional you can refer to them as "spec" assignments (which, if we spin it right... basically means you wrote it for someone, but it never got used)


If you're going after the sales copy market, you can use a similar process, but it will take a few different tactics to get your foot in the door. It's a tougher market to crack, but it can be more lucrative.

And of course, the best experience you can get in writing sales copy is to actually find something to sell (either your own product, or someone else's affiliate product).

This will give you true first hand experience in finding the right message to market match. Because the market won't hesitate to let you know if your copy skills are any good.

If they respond... then it's good...

If the market doesn't respond... then it's the wrong message, the wrong audience, or the wrong timing (or any combination of the three)


Here's another topic from a while ago that can give you a few more ideas on this subject

Selling yourself as a beginner and building a portfolio


Anyway Amy, hopefully somewhere in my ramblings you'll feel a nugget of wisdom you can use.

All the best,
Steve
A good marketer knows how to think like a marketer - A great marketer learns how to think like the customer...
SARubin - Direct Response Copywriter / Conversion Flow Expert
whatamydidnext
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Posts: 4
Joined: November 6th, 2021, 4:43 pm

Re: Newbie and Novice here!

Post by whatamydidnext »

Franklin wrote: November 6th, 2021, 10:47 pm Hi Amy -

Welcome to the forum. :)/
whatamydidnext wrote: November 6th, 2021, 7:03 pm
I think I'd like to start off with short form advertising copy. Particularly things involving technology, art, photography, music, film/tv, food, cosmetics, fashion. I'd also love to write about things I care about: the environment, our oceans, animal rights, pollution etc (Bit of a tree hugger, yes.)

As a graphic designer, I love designing things for publication; magazines, brochures, catalogues and so on, so yes I would love to do a bit of article writing (I'd rather not have someone else's wording on my design work) so I guess I'm one of those people who considers articles to be copywriting, haha!
That's a lot of different things to start with. You might want to niche down and pick the one or two things you're most passionate about to start with, then you can always expand as your experience grows.

I've seen a lot of new writers try to bite off more than they can chew. They almost always get overwhelmed and burnt out before they even get started.
Oh absolutely.
All the stuff I mentioned above was hist to give you aj idea of the sort of stuff I'm interested in. I wouldn't dream if taking all of that on as a beginner!

Thanks for the advice. I'll definitely narrow it down! :)
whatamydidnext
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Posts: 4
Joined: November 6th, 2021, 4:43 pm

Re: Newbie and Novice here!

Post by whatamydidnext »

SARubin wrote: November 7th, 2021, 10:32 am
whatamydidnext wrote: November 6th, 2021, 7:03 pm
Thank you! :)

I sort of want to be the Swiss Army knife of Graphic Design and Copywriting! :lol: I love designing, but I miss writing so I want to get started with it again.

I think I'd like to start off with short form advertising copy. Particularly things involving technology, art, photography, music, film/tv, food, cosmetics, fashion. I'd also love to write about things I care about: the environment, our oceans, animal rights, pollution etc (Bit of a tree hugger, yes.)
That's a very ambitious array of interest Amy, you've covered quite a few profitable niches here.
And a few environmentally responsible ones as well. Which I applaud because I'm an old tree hugger too :).

The only small issue I see is they're also quite competitive niches, with many writers who have a head start on you.
I'm with Franklin on this one. It might be more prudent to narrow your focus a little. At least in the beginning until you build your reputation.

whatamydidnext wrote: November 6th, 2021, 7:03 pm As a graphic designer, I love designing things for publication; magazines, brochures, catalogues and so on, so yes I would love to do a bit of article writing (I'd rather not have someone else's wording on my design work) so I guess I'm one of those people who considers articles to be copywriting, haha!

I'm worried about creating a portfolio though. Obviously I'm a total beginner; no experience, no past clients, nothing to show off. So how do I build an attractive portfolio? No one will hire me if I have no proven record of being a good writer, so I can't get any experience; it's a vicious circle!
Yes, it can be a vicious circle... But it doesn't need to be.

Right now you're in a bit of a catch 22 - You need experience to attract paying clients... but how can you get experience without any clients to write for?

If you just start putting yourself out there as an inexperienced writer, you're most likely going to attract low end clients and freebie hunters…
And in good conscience I can't recommend anyone building their reputation on that kind of a weak foundation.

Also, the competition for low end writers is fierce (as can be easily seen on any of the freelance farms like fiverr, freelancer, upwork, etc)

So because you have no experience, in this case I recommend you start creating your own experience.

Let me explain...

One word of caution: This is not a one or two day process. It could take weeks, or even months of effort before it pays off for you. But it's the kind of effort that most newbies will never do (because it's too much like real work) and as a result, if you're willing to play the long game, in a short while you'll be ahead of 90% of the other writers who are just starting out.


If you're going for content writing, then start writing content.
Find a couple niches that are interesting to you. Like I mentioned above - narrow it down at the beginning so you don't get too overwhelmed.

Study some of the more popular websites and study the articles and posts for their style and formatting.
And then start writing you own blog posts, essays and articles about that niche.

Write as if one of those top websites has commissioned you to write for them, and they are going to publish it. (in other words... don't half ass it. You will learn to write with the same discipline as you train. So write like you mean it.)

These samples will become part of your portfolio. And you can put your samples on display. (on your own blog or website, a social network, or somewhere your target audience hangs out...?)

This will be the beginning of your "experience". And if you want to sound more professional you can refer to them as "spec" assignments (which, if we spin it right... basically means you wrote it for someone, but it never got used)


If you're going after the sales copy market, you can use a similar process, but it will take a few different tactics to get your foot in the door. It's a tougher market to crack, but it can be more lucrative.

And of course, the best experience you can get in writing sales copy is to actually find something to sell (either your own product, or someone else's affiliate product).

This will give you true first hand experience in finding the right message to market match. Because the market won't hesitate to let you know if your copy skills are any good.

If they respond... then it's good...

If the market doesn't respond... then it's the wrong message, the wrong audience, or the wrong timing (or any combination of the three)


Here's another topic from a while ago that can give you a few more ideas on this subject

Selling yourself as a beginner and building a portfolio


Anyway Amy, hopefully somewhere in my ramblings you'll feel a nugget of wisdom you can use.

All the best,
Steve
Hi Steve,

Definitely some pearls of wisdom there, and lots to think about, so thank you.

Since you mentioned Fiverr and Upwork, do you recommend I give them a try? I was thinking about just giving it a go because there's nothing to lose by trying it, right? I'm not expecting or hoping to make millions from it; experience and proof are more valuable to me right now.

Thanks again!

P.s Always glad to meet a fellow tree hugger! :D
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SARubin
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Re: Newbie and Novice here!

Post by SARubin »

whatamydidnext wrote: November 7th, 2021, 4:31 pm
Since you mentioned Fiverr and Upwork, do you recommend I give them a try? I was thinking about just giving it a go because there's nothing to lose by trying it, right? I'm not expecting or hoping to make millions from it; experience and proof are more valuable to me right now.
Absolutely yes. One of the best things you can start doing right now is get your name out there in as many places as possible. The more exposure, the better chance the right person will show up looking for someone with your skills and talent.

Another one you can try is Linkedin. It tends to be a bit more corporate in nature but once you get a good reputation the pay is usually better.

Create your profile on as many freelance sites as you think you can maintain in the short term. (There's a ton of them out there, so visit a few and see which one's feel like a good fit for you)

And when 1 or 2 platforms give you better results, then you focus on those and forget about the ones that don't bring results.

And in all fairness, some people make a good living from those platforms (depending on what you consider "good")

After you have a good rep on a couple sites we can talk about marketing directly to clients (if you still even need to), instead of waiting around for them to find you. This is the method I prefer because it gives me more control over who (or whom) I market to.

But first, just get started building your credentials and exposure in the marketplace.

All the best,
Steve
A good marketer knows how to think like a marketer - A great marketer learns how to think like the customer...
SARubin - Direct Response Copywriter / Conversion Flow Expert
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